topic The camera is so disappointing in XPERIA archive

The camera is so disappointing

Wed, 10 Nov 2010 10:37:37 GMT

Why is the camera on the X10 being advertised as so good? It's clumsy, slow and awkward to use. No flash and pictures can be very difficult to take with blurring happening more times than not. One of the main reasons I choose the X10 over other devices was the promise of a brilliant camera.

Sony Ericsson, can you give us any information on future updates to the camera, eg wil we ever get the flash that you promised in a 'future update' and will you ever increase the screen colours? HD video recording is a great start (I'm yet to try it out as the update isn't available to me yet), but please bring the camera up to the quality I've experienced with previous SE devices

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Wed, 10 Nov 2010 10:42:25 GMT

Camera is VERY disappointing. And if you are relying on geotagging - be careful. My X10 tagged a photograph of a railway station in Northern Ireland as being in the North Sea!

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Wed, 10 Nov 2010 23:32:47 GMT

Not sure what exactly you find inferior to previous SE models (or other phone makes), I find the camera good:

(Click on images to see large size)

I have used several generations of Son Ericsson camera phones - since the Z600 (clamshell brother of the historic T610) - through S700 - W900 - k850 - C905 and now X10. I can testify the progress in cameras has been consistent and the X10 is no exception.

Ironically, with a new phone the first few photos give you some discomfort and the perception that it's "not as good as the older model" - very familiar feel (but very wrong!). As soon as you find your way around the settings and new features and get used to the new camera, you realise there is improvement and you learn how tomake the most of it. Even though by mere pixel count the X10 is supposedly identical to the C905, there are subtle differences in favour of the X10 - e.g., it has noticeably better noise handling, better exposures and a wider dynamic range within the 8-bit depth of the JPEG format.

Last but not least, for good results you need to remember the limitations of phone cameras (tiny sensor, tiny lens with fixed focal length, lens protector glass that diffuses withdust and fingerprints, lightweight body that shakes with your hand, breath and pulse). And knowingly work within and around those limitations, instead of setting undue expectations for profesional results while shooting carelessly like a clueless non-photographer.

Are you sure you are doing everything right - and still get poor rsults?

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Rocco1 — Wed, 10 Nov 2010 23:49:30 GMT

The camera is great on my phone. Have you even tried to take a picture with it. I took this picture with my phone last week!

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 00:32:10 GMT

That's because the geotagging is already set up to handle post-global warming.

(Just kidding; being stupid)

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 01:09:41 GMT

@Rocco1 - good capture! And even that can be improved: if you exposed for the sky (point the camera upwards and watch the sky 'darken' on your screen, half-press the shutter for the little square in the center to turn green - then, without letting your finger off the shutter in half-press mode, bring the lens down to compose and capture what you wanted to capture) - then you would get 2 benefits:

1. Sharper picture (the X10 can do a lot better) by bigger depth of field and faster shutter speed beating camera shake.

2. NIce sky with colour and clouds (as in my examples), rather than the washed-out (overexposed) you have now.

Exposing for the lighter areas, you will inevitably see the shadows too dark, nearly back - but you will be surprised how much info is kept in the JPEG and shadow detail can easily be brought out in your editing program (Photoshop, Gimp, Picassa on the PC - or Photoshop Mobile, PicSay, Photoenhancer - on the X10). Some editing (touching up) always helps bring the best form your phone shots.

Best of luck!

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 07:40:35 GMT

Are you guys comparing the camera on the phone to a normal digital camera? Or are you just being noobs?

Re: The camera is so disappointing

pratha — Thu, 11 Nov 2010 08:17:46 GMT

I feel like the colours are bit washed out. Other than that, it seems pretty decent picture. (Except low light photography)

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 10:17:23 GMT

Aha! I just knew SONY would be so brilliant as to future-proof their products like that. Just a pity they can't make them work in the present. ROTFL

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 10:19:29 GMT

(1) there is no such article as a "normal" digital camera.

(2) what is a "noob"? (apart possibly from a SONY customer service representative)

(3) any comparisons i have made are with other and better mobile phone cameras.

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 10:24:15 GMT

Sorry guys I should have been a bit clearer. The picture qulaity is normally great, and not really the problem. My problems with it are mainly down to the software, camera takes a fair while to load, and feels awkward to actually take pictures.

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 12:04:21 GMT

Agree with this. All digital cameras are normal, but they vary tremendously in quality, capabilities and... price. And, yes - modern phone cameras are also 'normal' camreas. They can and should be compared - favourably - to the lower end of non-phone cameras.

IMHO the current breed of good phone cameras should easily equal or beat anything up to £100 ($150) in the market, and - with some touching - match the quality of most cameras up to £200 ($300). This is a somewhat broad statement, but I am prepared to support it with evidence.

Anyone who expects photos like the ones they see in glossy magazines*, or the output of their friends' (semi-)pro DSLR... should correct their expectations.

(2) what is a "noob"? (apart possibly from a SONY customer service representative)

I would love to experience the interaction with a service rep of any other phone maker (or retailer, or operator/carrier) who is seriously professional and deeply knowledgeable. Can you point me to one?

(3) any comparisons i have made are with other and better mobile phone cameras.

This is very interesting: can you share the makes and models you have been comparing with? I'd love a list of phone cameras you found better than the X10.

* Even magazines have recently started accepting and publishing photos from phone cameras. Some of my own phone snaps have appeared in glossy magazines.

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 12:31:12 GMT

For less 'washed out' colours, I would suggest to set your EV level to -1/3 or -2/3. That's the little +/- square on the right: tap it and move the slider one or two notches to the left. Many small cameras (most of Sony Ericssons, too) tend to slightly over-expose. By correcting this - only a little - your images aren't too dark (there is still plenty of detail in the shadows), but the colours become more intense, naturally saturated (unike the fake effect when you use 'saturate' in an editing app).

Also, some of the poor colour rendition and loss of contrast is due to light diffusion. Keep your lens (the protector glass) clean from fingerprints and dust and wipe it with a soft cotton fabric (e.g. your clean t-shirt) before shooting. Also, when possible, avoid shooting into the light, try to position yourself and the subject for side lighting or 3/4 backing the sun. This results in much better contrast and colours.

As to low light - (1) Make sure you have the IS on at all times. 'Advanced settings' -> 'Image Stabiliser'. When it's ON, a small hand symbol appears on the right side of your screen. (2) Try to hold the phone as steady as you can and press the shutter smoothly (most camera shake occurs from rapid pressing of the button). Whenever you can, steady your camera by firmly touching a table, door frame or (outside) a car roof or a lamp pole. And for any still scene (when you're not following a moving object) - instead of presing the shutter, use the self-timer. That eliminates completely camera shake from your finger pressing.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

There's a lot more to good phone photography, beyond the scope of this thread and entire forum. Use Google, find specialised forums and tutorials and read, read, read. (If you don't feel like reading, don't complain about your camera )

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 12:52:51 GMT

Agree about the start-up time. Even 'proper' cameras are measured and compared for the seconds it takes from 'Power On' to ready-to-shoot state. Some expensive models are also criticised for that - but it's a by-product of the tremendously sophisticated microelectronics and software in today's cameras. The X10 is on the long-ish side of wait, but I have learned not to try to capture out-of-my-pocket a falling apple in mid flight, and for everything else it's OK. I would classify the start-up latency as 'just bearable'.

"..Feels awkward to actually take pictures..." - I didn't experience any difficulties. What exactly do you find awkward?

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 13:52:09 GMT

Have you tried a Japan-only cameraphone? I have one and a 5mpx can easily outmatch an 8mpx in terms of picture quality.

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 13:55:43 GMT

1.6's camera load time was definitely excruciating. I had a vehicular incident where the camera loading cost me a chance to prosecute a road bully.

2.1's load time is slightly better, but still much to be desired.

We do have to remember that essentially we have a phone with a camera function, not the other way around.

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 13:56:07 GMT

You must have a lot of stuff running on your phone in the background to slow the camera (and the phone itself) down. My camera starts up very quickly. From the initial button press on the home screen to when its ready to take a picture is less than 2 seconds for me.

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 16:04:19 GMT

There is also the problem of having a lower speed class of a microSD. It being slow will also affect the saving speed of the camera.

Re: The camera is so disappointing

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 20:38:20 GMT

It is a multipurpose device with a great camera features but it is not a pro camera dedicated device, I've not experimenting any issue even about loading software speed that does his job more than an adequate way, using a 2 class stick ! May be there are a lot of apps running in background that cause such issue like people said.. Try a cold restart or another memory stick.

(BTW..I'm going to upgrade my nickname fully but gradually because I've found an old member around using a very similar to my old one...:smileyplain:)

Re: The camera is so disappointing

sushidushi — Thu, 11 Nov 2010 21:31:17 GMT

The only thing I'd like to see on it is a camera flash, though there is something to be said for the 'modelling' light, in that it is easier to see what the result is going to be before pressing the shutter release button. Actually, I would like the facility to use real film in it. I still slightly disapprove of digital cameras, and will continue to do so till I can affford a good Canon DSLR. On the subject of megapixels, they only tell part of the story. A 'real' camera with a good lens is going to far out-perform a camera (in a phone or otherwise) with a simpler lens. We can't practicably change the lens on our phones, but keeping it scrupulously clean and free of scratches will make a positive difference. I do like your pictures, mae5tr0, especially the one of the trees.